Lee Short ([info]losrpg) wrote,
@ 2005-09-25 16:28:00
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Yawn
I'm so tired of this sort of thing: In specific: If you disagree with Forge theory before reading this, it will likely not convince you otherwise. It will, however, allow you to argue from a position of knowledge, rather than a position of ignorance. (from Ben Lehman's blog).

The arrogance is tiring. The continued assumption that if you disagree with Forge theory, it is because you don't understand it. This is the sort of 'discussion' about theory that I refuse to have. It's an unhealthy, incestuous discussion. The same sort of 'discussion' that allowed Chris Chinn and Vincent to make blanket assertions about "what traditional games do" and have those assertions go unchallenged...rather, the readers all nodded their heads sagely and said "tis so, tis so." Frankly, I don't blame Vincent & Chris...everyone slips once in a while. But everyone who nodded their heads along with the crowd...can't say a lot for them. John (and I) called them on it, and they all told him he was full of it. Oh, well, I guess everyone is welcome to their opinion. It's just kind of funny that they seem to think that this is a healthy discussion.

-------------

On to positive topics. The Star, The Moon, and The Cross -- I'm nearly done with chapter 6. Just a few key examples to go. Up to 21000+ words (48 pages), excluding the sidebars. For some reason, MS Word refuses to tally them in the word count. The first big feedback change from playback is in, too. Can't wait to give it (in the guise of Amber Shadows) a spin at AmberCon Northwest.



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Yeah
[info]ewilen
2005-09-29 06:59 pm UTC (link)
There are some hardcore types who are very busy fighting a war against the tyranny of traditional games. I think it's best to just let them get on with it in peace.

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[info]benlehman
2005-10-18 09:00 am UTC (link)
I'm curious -- how do you intend to have an argument if you don't understand what the other side is saying?

Everyone says "I don't agree with Forge *blah*" but then complains that they don't understand what it means. I don't see how you can disagree or agree with something that you don't know what it means. The goal of my essay is only to make sure that people understand what we are talking about. Whether or not they agree with us -- I don't care. But, once people understand what's being said, we can actually begin discussion and debate. Until then, we can only grunt and posture at each other.

Do you already understand Forge theory? Great! Get on some RPG discussion boards and talk about it. But maybe consider that an essay entitled "An introduction to Forge Theory" isn't for you.

yrs--
--Ben

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[info]losrpg
2005-10-18 03:58 pm UTC (link)
My post below was meant as a response to this.

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[info]losrpg
2005-10-18 03:05 pm UTC (link)
But maybe consider that an essay entitled "An introduction to Forge Theory" isn't for you.

Yeah, I realize this; I posted too soon. My bad.

But as to Do you already understand Forge theory? Great! Get on some RPG discussion boards and talk about it.

Actually, no -- what I need to do is stay off some RPG discussion boards and not talk about it. It doesn't offer enough to me to put up with its baggage -- and what I offer, it clearly doesn't want. There are some interesting topics to talk about in Forge theory, but it's hard to have a discussion of them without the baggage getting introduced. I am in fact generally friendly to the concept of making theory useful to the gamer mainstream -- and that's why I was reading your essay.

I have taken positive steps: I've purged my list of friends & links. Now I just need to be better about not following links to places I shouldn't go.

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